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As God by creation made two of one,
so again by marriage He made one of two.


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Birth-Control vs Lordship of the Womb

…and there is really so much to say on this matter.

teacuppamela.pngAs I was sharing yesterday and the day before on some pretty sensitive matters, I recognize that the matter of marriage, family size, the sovereignty of God and Lordship of the womb is probably one of the most volatile topics concerning marriage and family… and, sadly, is not embraced and promoted by the mainstream Christian writers/teachers/preachers in the church today and is seldom embraced by Christians in general — what a pitiful indictment against the church. Actually, I think that birth control and immodest and/or gender-neutral clothing are a couple of the most blatant. Both pit believers against God’s design. What a sad commentary – what a pitiful contradiction of the Word.
So I’ve continued to mull over the consequences of birth-control or the determined limiting of family size or the selfish, purposeful prevention of conception all together. The consequences are both huge and lasting and I believe the enormity of longterm effects in and through the church cannot be measured. Intentional barrenness is a strong delusion and judgment. Consider, simply, the contradiction to God’s Word those tiny little pills on a wheel present. Consider God’s eternal purpose and the design those little pills violate.Consider… the apple.

quotebegin.gifAnd when the woman saw that the tree was good for food,
and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired
to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat,
and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
Genesis 3.6

Just like that pretty red apple was, I think Birth-control is that expedient or pragmatic approach to most all many relationships marriages. But, in reality, we as Christians are not called to pragmatic living or to expedient living—we are called to faith. We are called to trust. I suppose that’s why I respond so ardently in opposition to things I know to be in violation of God’s design. The Bible isn’t antiquated, blessings aren’t antiquated and prayer is not passé. So, why then do most Christians deny the LORD in this area or reject His design for women, for marriage, for family and for the home? Now, it might not be an obvious or intentional rejection, but, in reality, Christians reject God’s design.

God’s so “pro-life!” just look at the intentional design of men and women… think of the millions of opportunities He has designed to meet *one* egg! Over and over and over… month after month. Now, that’s PRO-life! He surely didn’t have latex in mind back in the garden! And I don’t think it’s in His design today. He didn’t hand Eve her little leaf-purse size wheel of pills to take for three weeks of every month… especially when those little pills not only manipulate her cycle but also do not prevent conception… pregnancies are ended but conceptions aren’t prevented. What a sad sad thing… the church stands in line to swallow. If you’ve got a prescription for ten or twenty more years of blessing control, then I would respectfully ask you to pray about the next pill you intend to swallow. You may never have thought to question the methods you follow or the seemingly normal course of your life. You’d be innocently following what most people in the Church are teaching today (whether in the pulpits or by their lives). But—-when you are faced with the reality of the truth—when you truly hear the Truth of the Word… then… then, at that moment, at that point: you are responsible for your actions/decisions/behaviour. O, your actions may not instantly follow – but I’d say that like in all other areas of spiritual conviction, obedience is key. Prayer is key.
I had a comment that referenced the concept of “full quiver” thinking and I thought on that quite a bit—and respect what the writer was saying. Actually, I’ve thought on the matter quite a bit for many years and have many times attempted to personally steer clear of that label “full quiver” simply bcz I think it tends to do what birth-control does—only, in reverse. I think just as using birth control to limit family size is manipulative, so also (as many attempt to do) attempting to “have as many as possible” is sort of man-centered. And then… what often follows is another sad commentary bcz when man suddenly feels over loaded or “can’t handle anymore” then many (I’ve known) suddenly say: enough’s enough and the quiver is “full.”In the strictest sense or the intended sense of the term “quiverful” I suppose is, if a couple genuinely determines to be full-quiver or quiverful minded, then they just determine to leave the “quiver” open and the Lord fills it with arrows as He chooses… and in that, I would fully understand and agree with.But I think the problem with saying outloud that one is “quiverful minded” is that it tends to ostracize those with few or none and elevate those with “many.” I’ve known quite a number of women who have completely given the matter of conception and pregnancy to the LORD and yet have one, none or few children. There are many explanations for the none, one or few children… diabetes, pcos, cancer, endometriosis, hormone imbalances, age and on and on – just to name a few. These women are just as QF as the ones who’ve carried many children. So, that’s why I tend to avoid that label and attempt to strictly concentrate on the Lordship issue or position. For, when one is simply submitted to the LORD and to whatever He leads, directs, provides, etc., then whatever the outcome: none, few, many: will have been of faith. Period.

I’d just implore praying the LORD would provide the table… that the husband and wife could dine together and then as they thank the LORD for His mercy, His grace and His precious gift of salvation — for one another, for the meal they share and for His provision, that they would just humbly ask if He’d provide more chairs. And, if He sees fit to do so, then… praise. If not, then… praise. He is the LORD.It’s never too late to surrender one’s life, home, marriage, womb, children… to the LORD. O, the enemy will make it seem that way, but it is *never* too late this side of heaven. It’s never too late to repent of failings, of fear, of lack of faith, of surgical or chemical decisions/actions and it’s never too late to turn from following the ways of the lost and yield to the Living Lord. Never… it’s never too late this side of Heaven. You may never have another child. You may never bear a child in your womb. Lordship of the womb is not about numbers of children conceived there… it’s simply about faith regarding whatever does or does not happen there.

Choose you this day whom you will serve… And if anything but skin has come between you and your husband… pray. The LORD hears prayer. And He answers.

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  • Christian Faith

    Elaine,

    I think that a lot of your issue is that perhaps God has pricked your heart about this and you don’t want to obey. I find that a lot in my personal life as well. When I realize I have a “attitude” or disobedience, I get on my knees and ask God for forgivneness and to help me to obey Him in whatever I was fighting Him about.

    I also find it hard to believe that one can respect a person but have such a hurtful tone with them at the same time. The words you have directed at Mrs. Spurling have that. And one would think that if you have been reading her for awhile you would know that she is always gentle and kind with her words. Even when one chooses to disagree with her, she is gracious. That is the mark of a truly beautiful woman. Mrs. Spurling only writes what she believes the Word to say and does so with conviction. I would rather have a fool for Christ in my corner than someone who does not believe the Word to be true. Because then you are on shaky ground – then you are picking and choosing what is the “truth” and what is not. Just as you accused her of picking verses to suit her beliefs, it would be easy for anyone to pick and choose from a Bible that is not the complete truth!

    Finally, I agree with you that one textbook does not cover the whole population issue but I found Isabella’s post to be clearly written and written well having come from a 16 year old. Her tone was loving and kindness whereas your reply was attacking like she was ignorant.i,e “over your little science lesson.” It shows that when someone disagrees with you, you discuss with a level head but with hurtfulness. I know, I used to do the same thing. It is something you can overcome if you allow yourself too.

    I pray that you receive this with a open heart as I know how hard it can be when someone gives me words of “advice”. I don’t say any of this in attacking you but in hoping that you can glean from it.

    And for Mrs. Spurling, I am so glad that you are the woman you are. We need so many more that stand up for Christ as you do. May God be merciful and bless all of you!

    Christian Faith

  • Elaine

    Thanks for your thoughtful answers Pamela. I have a great respect for you. I did read what you wrote but perhaps projected things you didn’t intend to say on to it. That’s the problem with the written world. Anyway, this is my last post on the matter and I really honestly am glad that your children and home are a blessing to you.

    To Isabella, thank you for trying to reassure me as far as over-population but you are 16 and a student who read part of one “high school” text book. I think I will look at the tireless research of hundreds if not thousands of well educated scientists over your little science lesson. Or I could ask the hundreds of thousands of starving people who’d lives can not be sustained mostly because of drought caused by over-farming and/or ever growing deserts (all caused by the indirect effects of over-population) for their opinion regarding the matter.

  • Margaret

    Pamela,

    Thanks so much for your kind and encouraging words. I am trusting God and my husband too. God bless you!

  • I do understand much of what you’re saying – really and am not intending to shame anyone… actually, now I really see that you are not reading what I am saying. I am not saying your faith is less because you chose to have 2 children – and speaking of 35, I only had three children after age 35.

    Yes— if you have read my writing for any length of time I have often inferred or said that we will all likely be very surprised at what we come to fully see in heaven. I don’t know if we will all laugh—but I know we will all be humbled at the mercy of God.

    I understand what you are saying about apple-picking verses or concepts to suit our preferences… but I assure you, I am not intentionally doing so. I think God’s Word is true for all people in all places for all time — but I understand what you are saying about in times past there were slaves, etc., etc. But I think that’s where we see the whole law fulfilled in the teachings of Jesus where He teaches in Matthew 22.37-40

    “Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” I don’t know why you say I better go out and get some slaves… I don’t know why you talk in that way.

    I just said pray… pray if anything but skin has come between… what I meant by that is that if fear or man’s ways or whatever have come between you – then pray… let nothing come between you – and if some choose to allow things such as birth-control, or bitterness or manipulation or whatever (out of fear, etc.) then pray.

    And I don’t know about taking more than my fair share of God’s bounty — if you knew me you’d know that not only am I totally humbled at the blessings He has bestowed, I also am humbled that it’s all Him, all His work, all His choosing and that I cannot even grasp what a “share” of it is. You know what my fair share is? death —death; but for the grace of God I have life – period. I am in awe of this.

    I know it seems quite audacious to say whatever I say… but I will be a fool for Christ and I will hold fast to the Bible — but I never used it to shame anyone and I never will… the Bible stands. It stands alone. If there is any shame – it will be the shame that it is not read by believers in Jesus – that is the shame. I read it, I learn from it, I share it, I pray to live it. I try to never be flip about it or obnoxious in seeking application to life. I just read what it says and trust God for His Word and His work.

    I see you are ardently holding fast to the way you see it. I am not attempting to dissuade you or to persuade you to hear *me.* I write in an attempt to shine light in the world – to help women who are seeking understanding or who are looking for like-minded or like-hearted sisterhood. That’s all.

    You have some very valid points but I would still stand on what I have written and say that the LORD says that children are a blessing… that they are a gift and that the fruit of the womb is His reward (or blessing). I see that He has created us and He chooses the blessings of the womb as He is the giver of life and it is He who opens and closes the womb… I cannot fathom that great work of the LORD but I simply trust Him. That’s why I wrote that it is His doing/His choosing: one none or many. You will never hear or read me saying to have “20” or “35” or whatever number (I know you exaggerated the number simply to make a point and you didn’t really mean those particular numbers). Nor will you ever hear or read me saying that there is something wrong if the number is one or none. I cannot fathom how the LORD works — I just know that I know that I know it’s ALL Him. I believe if He wants fewer babies He will create fewer and if He wants believers to be open to His leading then He will prompt their hearts to be open to His blessing. I know that’s how He worked in our life/marriage and in countless others we have met along the way. We didn’t all confer together and make this plan to leave child bearing to Him. We do have similar testimony – but it’s of the LORD not of one another.

    Thank you, Elaine, really, for writing. Iron sharpens iron. You’re sharp.

    —pamela

  • Isabella

    I am writing concerning the comment made on the earth’s so called overpopulation problem. I am 16 years old and a homeschooled highschool student. Recently I have finished a Science textbook, and I am happy to inform you that we do not have this overpopulation problem.

    The research on this supposed problem confirms that there is no need to worry, let alone believe, that such a thing exists. Dr. Jay Wile writes, “The average mother must have 2.2 babies in order to keep the human population steady. It takes two people (a mother and a father) to have a baby. Thus, each mother and father needs to have 2 babies, one to “replace” each of them when they die. However, there are some children that die due to diesease or accident. These children will not replace the adults they are supposed to replace, because they did not live long enough to have their own children. If there aren’t a few extra babies born each year, the parents of those children will not get replaced when they die, and the human population will slowly decrease. Thus, the average mother must have just a little more than 2 babies in order to replace the mother, the father, and those whose children die early.”

    Unfortunately, many people in America have close to 1 or no children at all. Large families are limited. The average fertility birth rate of U.S. women in 2003 is 2.0 births during their lives (QuickStat, Center for Disease Control Reports).

    If some people do not have over the amount of 2.2 children, the population is going to decrease. A population that maintains a Total Fertility Rate of 2.0 over a long time will decline. Scientific research shows evidence to back these facts up.

    Children are a blessing, no matter how many you have. Coming from a family with 4 siblings, I have to say I would be deeply saddened to lose one, yet it would give me immense and unspeakable joy to gain another. The Bible states, “As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man; so are children of the youth. Happy is the man that hath his quiver full of them: they shall not be ashamed, but they shall speak with the enemies in the gate.” Psalm 127:4-5. God loves all, big or small, in his sight they are beautiful.

    The world mistakenly believes that children are not needed. Christian families are a picture of God’s grace, and share Jesus with humanity. Though flesh and sin corrupt the world, we as believers must stand true to what we know is right. Jesus said,”Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.” What better way to do this than for Christians to populate the earth with children who will be raised in God fearing homes, and be salt to a lost generation.

    The reader need not be afraid that people with large families will somehow cause the earth’s destuction and humanity’s extinction. That is in God’s hands. I once read about what the purpose of our (Christians) lives are, to go to heaven and to influence as many people with the lifechanging gospel of Jesus Christ as we can. The more people that exist on earth, the more people we have a chance to influence. Heaven will be filled with multitudes of all nationalities, all bringing glory to Him.

    If Jesus loved us so much as to die on the cross for us, should we not have enough love in our hearts for every living, breathing life? 1 John 4:11 states, “Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.” Who are we to choose whether or not we need these children? Their lives are so beautiful in his eyes. God is the ultimate decider in everything. Trust in Him and all will be as it should. We need not put our trust in what we do on earth, but only what He plans.

  • Elaine

    First off – Jill, please don’t tell me what my implications are or say I have “anger issues” Thankyouverymuch. I did not say the Bible should be ignored and that is has NO relevance today. That was putting words in my mouth.
    Go to this website http: //www. evilbible.com [[[[this was originally a link in Elaine’s comment.  I have unlinked it because it is hateful/evil/against God andI don’t allow that sort of linking here on my site.  I don’t follow the PC rules of “freedom of speech against God’s Word.]]]. Every word came straight from the Bible. Should we have slaves? Women can be raped? These words (man written) are what makes it so easy for non-believers to question or turn away from Christianity. You can’t apple pick the happy “Yay we can have all the cute little babies we want” verses and ignore the things they did back then that we simply know are wrong today.
    Regardless of what the PEOPLE who physically wrote the words contained in the Bible say that God said, man’s interpretaion is in it. As well as the ideas of the time. There are also the Catholic, and other Churches that have re-written the Bible to fit their propaganda. Even today we have people like Fred Phelps twisting the Word into a message of extreme hate.
    I could say God told me to write a book. Like Joseph Smith. Do you accept the Book of Mormon? Why not? It’s supposedly the Word of God told to a man. Who can say who is a false prophet? No human can be absolutely sure that every word in the Bible is 100% God’s word unless He physically wrote it.
    When we were told to go forth & multiply there had just been a big flood, you may have heard of it. Since there hasn’t been a follow up to the Bible how do we know we should still be multiplying? We know we shouldn’t own and beat slaves. How do you know the difference? If there is none you better go get some slaves.
    You feel the need to defend your choice to take more than your fair share of God’s bounty and have the audacity to use the Bible to shame (yes shame “if anything but skin has come between you and your husband – pray”) those of us who chose not to? How dare you say my faith is less because I CHOOSE to only have 2 children not 35?

    All in all, none of us are going to change each other’s minds here. I am at peace with our Lord and my salvation. I honestly wish you all well and Gods blessings and I’m sure we’ll ALL have a laugh together in Heaven over the ideas we had here on Earth. The Truth is more than any of us can fathom.

  • Margaret – and others who anguish over past decisions… today’s post was, in part, for you. I think the whole matter of childbearing, child-barrenness intentional or unintentional, natural or regretful, is probably one of the single most common areas of struggle in Christian marriages/homes. It is for this reason that I write on the matter and it is for this reason that I risk sharing a “hardline” view. For I fully recognize and tenderly sympathize with the struggle sisters share or have shared over the years. Some say it’s so personal that others ought not be involved in sharing about it… but it’s for this very reason that I share – it’s for this very reason that I take a risk and share things that aren’t talked about but most every couple/marriage faces. What to do about *that* area of life and its potential consequences.
    I believe that even though you may be struggling – even though you may have regret – you *are* doing what you are “supposed” to do. You are trusting. That’s the whole of the Christian life. Trust. If you have done something that you now see was in error or sin. Repent. Then if restitution needs to be made and *can* be made, then do that, too. If repentance has been made, you have submitted to God, confessed and turned from that way, then you are in His will and no matter what things *look* like today… you have peace with God. Peace with God is hearing what you’re told to do and doing it. That’s it. The enemy is the flinger of doubt… but that’s not of God—doubt is one of the enemy’s greatest strongholds for the believer… it’s the oldest, too…. hath God said???? So, trust. Trust God, trust your husband. If you have said to your husband, this or that is not right or I don’t feel that this or that is right or whatever… then you have said it. He has heard you. You may pray together, but your husband has heard you — The LORD has heard you. Walk in faith that God is the blessed Controller of ALL things. He is. And what’s more: He loves you. He loves us with an everlasting love. How amazing that is.

    thank you for writing
    —pamela

  • Jill—
    God bless you. Thank you — and amen.

    Standing still —pamela

  • Jill Bonanno

    I want to comment of the above reader’s alluding to the Bible being an outdated, not useful or appropriate for this time book, when she states “it’s been over 2 millenia since the bible was written.” The implication of her statement is “Well, why should we use it then, as being relevant today? What could it possibly teach us?”

    The reader also makes jest that the Bible is merely “A book written by MAN. 2000 years ago with the interpretations and predjudices of the time.” Nothing could be further from the truth!

    First off and foremost, the Holy Bible is both a historical and prophetical book, that has lived up to all of it’s claims. It’s historical accounts are backed up by archeology, and a great majority of it’s prophetic accounts have been fulfilled, with NONE of any prophetic accounts EVER been proven false! These external evidences support it’s claims, and denote this book to be evident of Divine inspiration.

    2 Timothy 3:16-17 reads that “all scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.” The Bible is a collection of 66 books, written by DIVINELY INSPIRED writers. I like to think of the Bible being “God’s Love Letter to Humanity.” It is incorrect to imply that the Bible is a book “written by MAM” only (ie. alluding to lack of divine inspiration), when furthermore, scripture itself tells us that “no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.” 2 Peter 1:20-21. Scripture tells us that GOD is the author of this great book!

    The Bible’s purposes are many, with 2 of the most important being it is a book that:

    1. Guides mankind in our journey through life to eternity.
    2. Leads us to a relationship with the God of this universe, through Jesus Christ.

    It is also incorrect to say that “Some of us here in the real world (you know 2007) realize we have done a great diservice to this planet that God created for us and are taking steps to rescue it.”(first reader’s comments). She goes on to say that having dozens of children is selfish in this regard.

    I want to say here that probably the greatest diservice mankind has done to this planet is to turn from the one true God, and follow the ways of the world (ie. ultimately, they are following the god of this world-Satan, if they are not following Jesus Christ).

    The creation of humanity is a reflection of God’s handiwork, and this is reflected when God said, “Let us make man in our image…” Genesis 1:26. Mankind was created, both male and female, and God blessed them. God commanded them to “Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it…” Genesis 1:28. God himself gave this mandate over Lordship of the womb. It is the sinfulness of man, which always falls into one of these 3 categories (#1. The pride of life, #2. The lust of the flesh, #3.The lust of the eye), that drives both men and women to control their destiny(s), instead of relying upon God, His Word, and His will for their lives. Culture and socialization also plays a great part in this today, making large families an abnormality. But God’s Word is still relevant for us today. It’s precepts still hold true, and one would show great wisdom by diligently seeking out these precepts, and by following them.

    Reader, you will NEVER rescue your planet! Bible prophecy declares that “the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store,” are “reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.” 2 Peter 3:7. In plain english, this earth, as we know it today, will one day be destroyed by fire. Revelation 21:1 also indicates this, “And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.” Remember, as I stated earlier, that no Bible prophecy has ever been proven false! People who think that they are going to rescue this planet are askew in their thinking. I am not saying here that we shouldn’t be good stewards of our planet and its’ resources, for I firmly believe that we should, but you can and never will save the planet Earth that we live on today. The Bible predicts this, and it’s predictions are true.

    It was commented that “having dozens of children” is selfish, when in fact, that was and still is, God’s original plan for mankind. In God’s economy, “Children are an heritage of the Lord and the fruit of the womb is his reward.” Psalm 127:3 It is a pity today, that a large majority of Christians, do not see this, believe this, and act in accordance to this!

    As a side note, and while on the subject of having large families, it is interesting to compare the birth rate of Christians and that of Middle Eastern Muslims, where we see a cultural dynamic in the Muslim faith that increases it’s population. Demographic changes create political pressure, and have been know to modify existing governments. This deserves consideration.

    Lastly, I want to commend you Pamela, for writing such wonderful posts! Being in the public arena avows you times of ridicule and attack, this is just the way it sometimes goes. But this too can be a great blessing. For God’s Word and truth can go forward in great power then, and these times hopefully can be turned into times of teaching for both believers and non-believers. Also, remember to “rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ’s sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.” 1 Peter 4:13. Keep writing what God puts on your heart, don’t be detoured, and God will bless it!

    On the Solid Rock,
    Jill

  • Margaret

    Pamela,

    First, let me say that I am so blessed to have 3 healthy children and am content with what God has given my husband and me.

    However, I would have to say that as I’ve grown in the Lord over the past few years, I have come to agree with you more about God’s Lordship of the Womb. But when I was younger and had my 3rd child, my husband and I decided for him to have a vasectomy. When I had my 3rd child, I felt I was at the oldest age I wanted to be to bear children. I’ve asked my dear husband on several occasions if he would get it reversed because I feel it wasn’t God’s decision but ours and he’s said no. Now that it’s done, it’s done and I can’t really blame him for taking that stand on it. I wanted him to have it done more than he did at the time. So I’m not angry with him about this. I’m probably more angry with myself. I really can’t say anything that will justify us making that choice but that’s where we were at that time in our lives.

    Now I feel that we circumvented God’s plan. How would you (if you were me) deal with that? I know God is still God and He’s still in Absolute Control. I know He can do whatever He chooses and I could still get pregnant if He chose for me to. But I know it’s probably not likely that it will happen.

    So, I grieve somewhat (even today) over that decision. I trust that if God wanted my husband to have the procedure reversed that my husband would do it. And I submit to whatever my husband decides, knowing that God has appointed him as spiritual leader of our home. Still I struggle with this on occasion. Do you have any advice for me?

  • Elaine—
    It’s hard to think of a particular thing to say other than: ouch.

    You are right in saying neither of us is “righter.” I fully recognize that there is none righteous, no not one. As you can tell from my writing year after year, I never assert that I am. And I don’t really know why you’re writing in the manner that you are but I don’t mind having dialog with you. But I would simply ask that you not read into what I’ve written things I’ve not written.

    I never said or intimated anything remotely close to saying “if you don’t have 20 kids you’re a sinner.” I can see that you didn’t really read my post and read into it many things that weren’t written. I used the word “zingers” bcz that’s what I felt were the ad hominem comments made concerning your interpretation of things I have written.

    You said…
    >>>>>”””…YOU want to treat your uterus like a clown car. You enjoy playing Little Suzy Homemaker like when you were little. You’re a little too simple (hence submition to your husband since you can’t make it on your own anyway) to have a career so you insult those who are fufilling OUR OWN God written path in that way. That’s fine, it’s your choice. It’s what’s right and true for YOU and YOUR life. But I think it’s awful of you to bully people to further over populate the earth and speed it’s demise using the bible. A book written by MAN. 2000 years ago with the interpretations and predjudices of the time. Some of us here in the real world (you know 2007)>>>”

    I don’t write to shame others and if you were a regular reader here you would surely know that. I don’t know where that came from. What I meant by saying that I will likely answer (the things you wrote) along the way bcz this blog is sort of slices of life and things always seem to have a way of coming up and being discussed. I never said/meant ‘sideways’ I don’t know why you’ve said things the way you have…. but whatever, I don’t write without attempting to also line up with the Word of God. It’s a living Word for today – that’s why I write the things I write… bcz the Word is living and relevant and timeless.

    Our children are normal size for each of their ages and after bath time we do wear robes.

    still standing — pamela

  • Elaine

    He is with me. I have been walking my path for many years also. Neither of us is “righter”. So it would not seem childish to reply to my points. It would seem like you are able to back up the assertions you feel so free to shame others with. But obviously you can’t. So God Bless and carry on.
    Just be careful about projecting YOUR personal opinions onto The Word of OUR Lord so that you can “fling” sideways (if you don’t have 20 kids you’re a sinner) “zingers” at people who are on their own personal walk with Him.

  • It would probably seem childish and retaliatory to reply to all the points of your letter; though I’m sure I’ll answer it along the way in different blog posts. I will not intentionally fling zingers back atcha. I write what I write from where I’m standing and from how the view of the Word and the world looks from here. I have been walking this path many years and am trusting the LORD to continue to direct the way ahead.

    I do pray He will be with you as well.

    Still standing — pamela

  • Elaine

    I want to ask if you ever give any allowance to the fact that it’s been over 2 millenia since the bible was written? Ever? Well I guess you do when/if it suits you. You do understand that the world was not over populated and choking on the filth and garbage of humans then, right? YOU want to treat your uterus like a clown car. You enjoy playing Little Suzy Homemaker like when you were little. You’re a little too simple (hence submition to your husband since you can’t make it on your own anyway) to have a career so you insult those who are fufilling OUR OWN God written path in that way. That’s fine, it’s your choice. It’s what’s right and true for YOU and YOUR life. But I think it’s awful of you to bully people to further over populate the earth and speed it’s demise using the bible. A book written by MAN. 2000 years ago with the interpretations and predjudices of the time.
    Some of us here in the real world (you know 2007) realize we have done a great diservice to this planet that God created for us and are taking steps to rescue it. This Earth was not made for us to be selfish and use up all we can grab of it. Including having dozens of children (that by the way annoy everyone but you). That’s selfish. Not very God like is it?
    I am very offended when you say I am going against the word of God when I cherish my family AND my home/planet so my reasonable sized family will have a future to grow up into. I am following our God. Don’t you dare say that my way is wrong simply to make you feel better about your life choices. Do you really think Jesus in his infinite wisdom thinks we should continue to destroy the Earth like we are? Really? Do you think The Lord is happy to see the species He lovingly created becoming extinct so that YOU can drive your over-sized consuming hoard around in a gas guzzling vehicle?

    Oh and this has always bugged me. You do understand that if we were to dress as in the bible men would be wearing “dresses”. Like Jesus did. Deciding to dress in Victorian male/female roles is a little legalistic isn’t it? If you are following the bible to the letter I better see some robes on ya’ll. Including your husband and sons.

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Thank you for joining me here today, may the Lord bless you and your home.